| Archive for nmfhssouthport.myfreeforum.org North Meols (Southport) Family History Society |
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ELLEN HOWARDI just recieved the marriage cert for William Rimmer age 23 (1849)bachelor and Ellen Howard age 28 (1844) spinster his father was as expected William rimmer (fisherman) but hers was listed as John Ball (labourer) both residents of marshside marriage after banns 15th june 1872.can anyone shed light on why her fathers name is ball and who is her mother? if any one has this lady on their tree could you be so kind as to point me in the right direction I have been acquiring certs to confirm info, thought I had this one right....boy was I shocked when I got the cert. |
| Dotty |
Oh heck...Just when you think it's all over...Good luck with the search! Dotty 
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| Jane |
Maybe her Mother wasn't married when she was born. And later married Mr Ball ?
Looks like you need to find Ellen's baptism now............... |
| Germaine |
Sounds like the saga we ahd with the Howards and Meadows a while ago.
Can't see her on my tree but will have a root about when I wake up proper. 
Could be like Jane said or even that her mother married someone else other than John Ball. I found one last week. She married in the name Cowell naming her father but when I eventually found her baptism her mother was calling herself Hornby. Luckily I now know the family were using that name at the time. Her mother went on to marry someone else not her father. So on familysearch she was down as Dewhurst on the census Hornby and married as a Cowell. 
Germaine x
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| SeaCopRimmer |
Hi
Should this be Ellen JOHNSON? I can find no baptism for either Ellen Johnson or Ellen Ball for around the time of her birth (i.e. 1842-48). I have searched under the surname Ball and Johnson nor can I find anything with father's name different to child/mother. Seems as if the original record needs to be looked at? |
| Germaine |
Well spotted Sea Cop. That needs to be looked at.
Also on the 1881 they have a sister living with them. Now she states unmarried and her name is Alice Threlfall ??. Is this the right William and Ellen Rimmer. Oh who are the wit. will that give a clue. Germaine x
Oh Alice Threfall is William Rimmers step or half sister so we can rule out looking at her connection. |
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link to copy of the certificate
http://i175.photobucket.com/album...ls/williamrimmerellenhowardMC.jpg |
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John, James and little sister Margaret are Williams siblings. I think James is his brother and Mary is james's wife Mary nee Hooten. one thought I had was that mommy was pregnant with John Balls child but married a Howard, father died perhaps or left her. need to check on that line of thought |
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1844 lancashire BMD
HOWARD William BALL Margaret North Meols St Cuthbert North Sefton C9/1/162 could this be mom? England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915 Name: Ellen Howard Year of Registration: 1844 Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar District: Ormskirk County: Lancashire Volume: 21 Page: 595 this might be her will have to send for the cert. |
| SeaCopRimmer |
Parish Record of Marriage:
15.06.1872 William Rimmer X 23, Bach, Fisherman, Marshside; father William, Fisherman Ellen Johnson, X 28, Spinster, Marshside; father John Ball, Labourer Married by Charles F Holt, Curate, after Banns Wit: James X Rimmer and Mary Rimmer James and Mary (nee Hooton) were William's brother and sister-in-law NB: William Rimmer (Snr) married Jane Threlfall (Widow) of Halsall in 1884 |
| Germaine |
Oh that is a strange one again isn't it . Registered as Howard but in the parish records as Johnson. 
I wonder would it help to get one of her chidlrens birth certs and see what it gives as her maiden name on that. Germaine x
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| SeaCopRimmer |
Baptism at St Cuthbert's:
17.06.1844 : Ellen d of Thomas and Jane Howard, Crossens, Labourer The only Ellen of the right age
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| sooner |
this is getting stranger as we progress.. if the parish one is the correct on, and I don't see why it wouldn't be as they would know all the locals, then she must have given the name she went by to the registrar.. |
| Dotty |
I say...Maybe she lived 'over the brush' with Mr Howard so she wouldn't be married but then she should have put formerly Johnson...Oh, if only we could go back in time and ask them what they were playing at! Dotty |
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have ordered a certificate of birth for John Rimmer I am hoping it is the right one....added parents names for reference....I had 5 to choose from for that year in Ormskirk so I chose the ref that had 2 on the same page. hope one of them is him other wise its 3 I will have to order and at the exchange rate its rather expensive. will update when it either arrives or I get a refund. |
| SeaCopRimmer |
William (Snr) married Jane Threlfall of Halsall; he was born 1814 and was the son of Edward Rimmer and Ellen Lunt.
John Rimmer, brother of William (Jnr), is my great-grandfather. Recently discovered that the nickname 'Willox' refers to whelks 
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 got John's birth cert today....it reads 12th Feb 1874 John, boy, father William Rimmer, fisherman. mother Ellen Rimmer formerly Johnson, mothers mark marshside, Northmeols
so do I put her down as JOHNSON? with father John Ball and mother Jane and Thomas Howard as stepfather |
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so would Thomas Howard and Jane Twist junQ 1843 be their marriage? |
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1843 deaths
Surname First name(s) Age District Vol Page Deaths Jun 1843 BALL John Ormskirk 21 385 Deaths Mar 1844 BALL John Ormskirk 21 426 possible dads |
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possibles 4 Ellens birth
Births Mar 1843 Howard Ellen Ormskirk 21 542 Births Sep 1843 Howard Ellen Ormskirk 21 513 Howard Ellen Ormskirk 21 519 Births Mar 1844 HOWARD Ellen Ormskirk 21 595 |
| Yvonne |
Ellen b c1859 daughter of Thomas and Jane nee Twist married Samuel Newton 1877 |
| sooner |
cross that marriage off then |
| Dotty |
Well..A clear case of a negative being turned into a positive...at least you found out without having to pay for a cert!Dotty being diabolical 
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you have know idea how I sweated the arrival of his birth cert.... 5 to choose from and I got the right one first time...... he's watching me and helping..... gladys had her christening as jun 17 1844 so she was conceived about sep/oct 43 if christened right away but given that christenings took place ususally within the first 6 months of life she could have been born anytime from dec 43- jun 44 conception could have taken place as early as feb 43. so I'm lookoing for a marriage from mar 43 - jun 44 I think |