These are my closest links to the Twists, my grandma Bond and her mother Mary Thompson (nee Twist) my great grandmother. Mary was the daughter of Charles and Elizabeth Twist (nee Gaskell) and is with them aged 11 on the 1901 Census at Martin Mere. She married Charles Thompson 20th Feb 1915 at St Mark's, Scarisbrick.
Hello Dotty,
Given the length of the answer, that could be a lot of questions...
I am looking at Joyce Otterstrom's tree - new to me and looks very useful. She has William Twist born in Aug 1811, issue of James Twist and Margaret Leatherbarrow, both of North Meols (this is the one mentioned by Bez). The Thomas Twist mentioned by Baxter seems to be very Ormskirk-based and is a hatter rather than a farmer. Any reason for thinking it's this Thomas who is the father of that William rather than James?
Bez also mentions a William Twist marrying in 1929. Do you have any information on their progeny? Just to check whether they had a James born around 1840.
Thanks everyone.
Best regards,
Charles
There is a James Twist baptised 15th March 1840 at St Cuthbert's, but he is the son of William and Martha of Scarisbrick.
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As far as I can tell the William Twist who married Ellen Sumner 9th November 1829 at St Cuthbert's seems to have died just over a year later (buried 25th November 1830 at St Cuthbert's). This William was the son of Joh Watkinson Twist and Alice (nee Howard).
William had one son, John Twist, who seems to have married Alice Brookfield (daughter of Peter Brookfield, labourer) 8th January 1852 at St Cuthbert's. Both John and Alice are my 2nd cousins 4 times removed (at the minute).
And of course John Watkinson Twist was the elder half-brother of my 3x great grandfather James Twist, whose 2nd wife was Ann Hooton, daughter of John Hooton who is famous for the handloom weaving and also for being the Revd. George Greatbatch's "minder".
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Hello Steve and Bez,
It would seem that John Watkinson Twist (b1780) was also a weaver. I didn't realise John W Twist and James Twist were half-brothers...? Was there a lot of weaving in the area? Did they use cotton or wool (or linen which I notice was grown in the area)? Although the North Meols Twist's seem all to be farmers (husbandmen), there is some suggestion that the name Twist comes from twisting threads.
Steve: I was talking to Bez off-line and she thought that you might have a photograph of the headstone: CH U9 10/5, Horizontal sandstone, quite good condition. The burial place of JAMES and ANN TWIST, et alia.
If you do, would you mind sharing it?
Thank you for your interest.
Best regards,
Charles
James Twist, whose 2nd wife was Ann Hooton, daughter of John Hooton
And whose 1st wife Mary Boond was apparently a 1st cousin 5x removed of mine , her mother being my GGGGG aunt Ann Jackson
Incidentally the Jacksons were quite cosy with the Hootons; two of Ann's nieces, Alice & Ann, married William & Thomas Hooton, sons of aforementioned John, I think, and therefore brothers of James Twist's 2nd wife
Sorry, I haven't got James and Ann Twist's gravestone yet. As to the weaving, going by the Census records it seems to be mostly cotton, although there were a few silk weavers.
At one time there were said to be over a thousand looms at work in North Meols - apparently of John Hooton's design for the weaving of cotton. Some silk weaving was also done and when the bottom fell out of the cotton weaving industry people reverted to the weaving of silk. There had always been some weaving done as sailcloth was produced locally.
There is a legend published in the Southport Visiter 10 years after the death of John Hooton which says that he was summoned to appear before Anna Maria Bold (owner of one half of the manor) as she had concerns that the shaking of the looms would cause the cottages to collapse. He was able to reassure her that this would not happen, nor would the farmers crops be neglected.
It would seem that even when the handloom weaving of cotton was at its height (and most profitable) the people still had to tend the land and get the harvests in. Later, when the market collapsed and most people changed over to silk weaving, they tended to take on work as labourers and would also supplement their incomes by going out shrimping on a regular basis. They would weave (or labour) by day and shrimp by night.
Regarding John Watkinson Twist - I discovered William Twist's Will in the LRO at the same time as Joyce Otterstrom received a transcript of it. The existance of John Watkinson Twist was hitherto unknown to either of us and turned out to be Ann Watkinson's illegitimate son born some 6 years before his mother married William Twist. William's daughter Ann and James' widow Ann (Hooton) both inherited part of a large parcel of land inbetween Cambridge Road and Denmark Road in Churchtown. John Watkinson Twist also seems to have inherited part of this parcel of land, which was sublet to an Alice Halsall, but it is difficult to determine as the names of the occupiers had changed by the time of the Tithe Map. What is certain is that John himself occupied a farm on the corner of Longacre and Marshside Road, which he rented from a John Watkinson.
Brian - you are correct - 2 of John's sons married into the Jacksons.
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My GGG grandfather James Halsall (1804) was the illegitimate son of Margery Halsall and a James Twist, who was himself the illegitimate offspring of Mary Twist (1739-1794) and Peter Ball. Looking at Joyce O's work Mary is the brother of William Twist.
I wonder if the Alice Halsall you mentioned as sub-lessee of JW Twist's land is any connection to my Halsalls? Can't see how at the moment
B
Hello,
Thanks Bez for the local context.
I picked up on the fact that there was a recession in the late 1870's (caused by US banks failing - I've heard that before...). I wonder whether that drove my GGgrandfather back from Chester.
I have two more puzzles for you to consider.
If you look at the grave stone, it tells about a Thomas son of John Twist. Joyce Otterstrom doesn't list a record of him. Is there no trace?
It also tells of a Margaret Johnson. If she is the issue of James and Ann as stated, then she would have been Margaret Twist. Yet there is no trace of her either.
Any offers?
The other thing I notice is a trend to births and burials at St Cuthbert but marriages at St Peter and St Paul, Ormskirk. I haven't done any stats or anything, just a feeling. Might there be a reason?
Best regards,
Charles
Posted: Mon Apr 06, 2009 1:28 pm Post subject: Errr...
Off the top of my head I can think of one reason to be buried at St Cuthberts...there was a family plot so they didn't have to fork out for another or be buried in Potters Field.
Only a thought...I don't have many worth admitting to!
Dotty
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I think the early Twist's migrated here from Ormskirk, because the earliest entries in the St Cuthbert's registers are for baptisms and burials. Unfortunately I have never had the time to investigate this.
Thomas, son of John and Alice Twist of Scarisbrick was baptised on 22nd October 1797. He was buried on 8th May 1828, at which time he was living in Tarleton.
Re Margaret Johnson - it doesn't actually say she was the issue of James and Ann, only that she died in 1808 aged 99, giving an approximate birth date of 1709 - earlier than the first recorded baptisms for the name of Twist at St Cuthbert's.
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I have just received an email from Joyce Otterstrom about this. She has now updated the Twist part of the database and Thomas is definitely on it.
Also, she has pointed out that Margaret Johnson isn't actually in the burial register for St. Cuthbert's - I hadn't looked at the transcripts myself, but Joyce is absolutely correct, Margaret is definitely not in the transcripts.
So we have a name and a partial date, plus an age for a woman who may, or may not be in the grave, and who was not baptised at St Cuthbert's, nor married there if we assume that she was born a Twist. There is only one marriage of a Johnson male to a Twist female and that was in 1812, which is 4 years after this woman died.
A mystery indeed.
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, her mother being my GGGGG aunt Ann Jackson
